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Rolf
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Med referanse til 1 Kor. 8:2 erklærer jeg herved at siste tog går nå:
1976: I ’Jøder og Kristne’ av teologen, professor Pinchas Lapide heter det:
”- de fire evangelier er åpenbart ikke historie, men trosdokumenter, skrevet meget senere.”
2005: Kristnerd, SITAT:
at Damaskus skulle være ett «kodeord». Slikt tull, uanset opphav, faller på sin egen urimelighet. Det blir som å si «kan Mor Åse fly?
SITAT SLUTT.
1966: Arne Duve, sitat:
For å vende tilbake til Paulus, er det vel neppe noen tilfeldighet at hans tilknytning til Damaskus er så sterkt markert. Professor Frank Cross jr.
ved Harvard som har vært med på de senere utgravninger av Dødehavsruller, er etterhvert blitt overbevist om at Damaskus var den betegnelse sektens
medlemmer brukte på samfunnets samlingssted ved Dødehavet. Da blir det sammenheng i den merkverdige beretning i Paulus Galaterbrev - at han ikke
straks dro opp til apostelkretsen i Jerusalem, men var i Arabia og Damaskus i 3 år. Hele Paulus' skriftlige produksjon er forøvrig gjennomvevet av
orientalsk gnosis og mysterieuttrykk, således taler han ofte om «Kristus i meg».
Paulus er en parallell til Aron, som var Mose talerør, som Paulus er blitt det når det gjelder Jesus og hans lære. De senere utgravninger ved
Dødehavet bekrefter fullt ut antagelsen av sekten som et esseer-samfunn.
Litteraturen om disse funn er etterhvert blitt enorm.
Tidspunktet ved begynnelsen av vår tidsregning var gunstig for en ny eller fornyet religion. Og kristendommen fant vekstvilkår da den først var blitt
plantet inn i verden. For å forstå en av årsakene til dens raske utbredelse i de første århundrer etter Jesu død, må en også kjenne litt til den
romerske keiserdyrkelse som så å si hadde beredt jordbunnen for evangeliets seiersgang.
Det romerske imperium hadde i stor utstrekning revet ned nasjonale og kulturelle grenseskjell mellom folkene, som var blitt sluttet mer eller mindre
fast sammen i et stort fellesskap med et internasjonalt språk - koine-gresk. Det handelspolitiske samkvem nådde en høyde som aldri før. Gresk ånd og
gresk kultur søkte å holde delene sammen til et stort hele.
I denne brytningstid da folkene kjente seg rotløse fordi de var rykket opp fra sin tidligere nasjonale og religiøse sammenheng, inntrådte det et dypt
forfall i det religiøse og moralske liv. Fordervelsen og mismotet spredte seg i stadig større ringer. Folkene vendte seg fra de fedrene guder. Men
gjennom bulderet fra forfallet tonte lengselen etter den store fred, rettferd og levelige vilkår.
Med keiser Augustus syntes det å være kommet et håp inn i all fortvilelsen. En ny tid varslet sitt komme. Keiseren pristes av dikterne som en
redningsmann sendt fra himmelen. En nasjonalromersk æra ble søkt innledet, de gamle guder kom på ny til heder og verdighet.
Sitat slutt.
2001: Timothy Freke and Peter Gandy,
QUOTE:
In Acts 9:3 Saul sets out to Damascus armed with letters of authority from the high priests in order to persecute followers of ‘the
Way’. It is unlikely that Paul was headed for Damascus in Syria, as this was a Roman province over which Jerusalem had no authority. Qumran,
however, with its community of fiercely anti-Jerusalem Jews, might well have been Paul’s destination. (see Baigent, M., and Leigh, R., (1991),
144ff). The Essenes referred to their faith as ‘the Way’ and the Dead Sea Scrolls also refer to the ‘Mystery’ that has been
hidden for a long time and is now revealed to the elect’, a sentiment expressed by Paul in 1 Corinthians 2:7, Romans 16:25 and Ephesians 3:3-9
See Ringgreen, H. (1995), 62ff, and Allegro, J. (1956), 145.
The Damascus Document found amongst the Dead Sea Scrolls tells of how the ‘Teacher of Righteousness’ took ‘the righteous
remnant’ (the Essenes) into the wilderness where they entered into a ‘new covenant in the land of Damascus’ (6.19, 19.33)
Josephus tells us that the Essenes regarded ‘fate (heimarmene) as the mistress of all things’ (Antiquities, 13:174) In Galatians 4:3
Paul refers to ‘bondage under the elemental rulers of the cosmos’, ta stoicea tou cosmou, stoicheia tou kosmou’, a phrase equivalent
to the astrological meaning of heimareme. See Martin, op.cit., 106-7 (The Hellenistic Religion, Oxford University Press, 1987) (Ephesians 6:12:
‘For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities [arche], against powers, against the rulers [cosmocrator] of the
darkness of this world [aion], against wickedness in high places.’
‘Damascus’ was a code word used by the Essenes to refer to their base in Qumran, which suggests that Paul, like Simon, had Essene
affiliations. He uses the same language as the Essenes, for example when he describes human beings as being enslaved by the powers of fate, imagined
as ‘the elemental rulers of the cosmos’ the ‘archons of this dark cosmos’ ‘from which Christ have set us free.’
……………………………
Acts is clearly not written by a single author, as is claimed. At Chapter 16 the narrative suddenly jolts from the third person into the first
person, something which continues sporadically through the book. So, like the gospels, Acts of the Apostles is a " cut and paste" creation.
This explains why it is not even internally consistent. For example, in Chapter 9 we are told that when Paul received his vision of light and heard
a divine voice on the road to Damascus, his companions "heard the voice but could see no one." Yet in Chapter 21 Paul is made to relate of the same
experience: "My companions saw the light, but did not hear the voice that spoke to me. "
Acts also contradicts the testimony of Paul in his Letter to the Galatians. According to Acts, after his visionary experience on the road to
Damascus, Paul is told to seek out a disciple called Ananias in Damascus, who will tell him what to do. He then goes to Jerusalem, where Barnabas
introduces him to the apostles. In the Temple at Jerusalem he experiences a second vision of Jesus and receives his vocation to preach to the
Gentiles. Yet this is quite different from Paul's own account, in which he makes no mention of Ananias and claims he went to Arabia and had nothing to
do with Christians in Jerusalem for three years after his conversion experience. He states emphatically: "What I write is plain truth; before God I am
not lying." So who is lying?
Like the Gospel of Mark, the Acts of the Apostles also misquotes the Hebrew Old Testament. It portrays Peter as proving his point to the Jews of
Jerusalem using a badly translated passage from the Greek version of the Old Testament, which in the original Hebrew means something else altogether,
Acts also portrays James as likewise appealing to the Jews of Jerusalem by quoting a passage from the Greek Old Testament that distorts the Hebrew
original.(Acts 15v13-41) The Jerusalem Jews cannot have been very impressed! From this evidence alone, scholars have concluded that Acts cannot be
taken as a historical record of the Jerusalem Church.
This is also borne out by the evidence of when Acts was written. It was regarded as holy scripture by Irenaeus and Tertullian, who lived at the end
of the second century. But Justin Martyr, living a generation earlier, displays no knowledge of it. It is not quoted before 177 CE, so it is
definitely not a contemporary account, as it claims to be, and was probably written somewhere between 150 and 177 CE.
There were actually many different scriptures relating the deeds of the disciples in circulation among early Christians, but no one considers the
non-canonical tales of the apostles as historical documents, Why should we treat the canonical Acts of the Apostles with any less skepticism, just
because the Roman Church authorities decided to include it in the New Testament? The scriptures dealing with the mythical exploits of John, Peter,
Paul, Andrew, and Thomas were banned and consigned to the bonfire in the fifth century by Pope Leo the Great as dangerous heretical lies. The
canonical Acts of the Apostles was spared such a fate simply because, unlike these other gospels, it endorsed the "party line" of the Roman Church.
UNQUOTE.
1993: Bishop of Newark, John Shelby Spong:
QUOTE:
I look at the authority of the Scriptures as one who has been nurtured by and then disillusioned with the literal Bible. My devotion to the bible was
so intense that it led me into a study that finally obliterated any possibility that the bible could be related on to literal basis… A literal
Bible presents me with far more problems than assets. It offers me a God I cannot respect, much less worship. … Those who insist on biblical
literalism thus become unwitting accomplices in bringing about the death of the Christianity they so deeply love.
UNQUOTE,
1999 : Right Revd. John Shelby Spong, Bishop of Newark and author of ‘Why Christianity Must Change or Die:
QUOTE:
“The Jesus Mysteries is a provocative, exciting and challenging book. It will force Christians to recognize that what we call orthodoxy is not
orthodoxy because it is right, but because it has won. Timothy Freke and Peter Gandy will force a new debate in Christian circles for which the Church
will ultimately be grateful.
UNQUOTE.
Siste tog er gått.
Rolf
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Kristnerd
Administrator
Innlegg: 2645
Registrert: 19-7-2003
Bosted: Rogaland
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Denne tråden har beveget seg langt bort fra det opprinnelige tema. Den har til tider hatt tendens til å likevel "snu" tilbake til Evolusjonslæren.
Samt at de tema den har berørt har hatt relevans med tanke på å finne et grunnlag for debatt rundt evolusjonslære-skapelse, Bibel - vitenskap. Likevel
velger jeg nå å stenge tråden for videre posting. Det oppfordres til å istedenfor starte nye tråder som tar for seg mer begrenset tematikk.
«Forstår du det du leser?» «Hvordan skal jeg kunne forstå,» sa han, «når ingen forklarer det for meg?»
\"Se på dere selv, søsken, dere som ble kalt: ikke mange vise etter menneskelige mål, og ikke mange med makt eller av fornem slekt.\"
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